I don't know if you've ever played with the servicenow calculator because they actually have one that you can go and put all of your details and every time I laugh because I did one for one of my the one you helped me estimate after our advisory engagement and it was like they need 47 people and I was like let's do things and I was like we need a full-time admin developer we need a full-time icon person that manages the cmdb I mean you take it and it's so funny because it's like you need these many developers and me as many and I'm like you do need more than one but I don't know that you need 47. hi I'm Alice hi I'm Justin and you're listening to the utterly awesome podcast who knows what we'll talk about oh [Music]