so welcome everybody to our bi-weekly Digital Services Forum call today what I'm going to go through is some pretty detailed descriptions of two contributions that I'm going to make to the community and then talk a little bit more about the how we do that on an ongoing basis so those are the the two big goals for today and then at the end we'll spend the last few minutes just talking about upcoming content and how we're working towards getting you answers to some of the things you asked for on the last two calls we did these small surveys so today's your first time we always go through the the notes on Zoom if today's your first time can you just share your name and your company inside of the chat so that everybody can know it's your first time and we can welcome you to the group and the other thing I'd like to let you know here one of the resources and Rod we were talking about this the other day there's there's a digital Services forum and that's on a servicenow community there's our YouTube channel and then the third resource we have right now is the shared instance if you needed access to the shared instance I'm going to demo from that today so you'll see some of the stuff that's on it but if you need access to that the only way to get that right now is by email hopefully we'll create a service for that in the future so that I can just put you on as admin on the share instance through an approval but you'll see what I'm talking about in a little while what that shared instance is just a little bit about the group before we go into the content for today and this is again mostly for the people that are here for the first time the idea behind the Forum is that we want to help people with digital Transformations and we don't want to just do the regular stuff that always happens or we don't want to demo products there's a lot of places you can go for servicenow to demo products but just how do we support that digital transformation and mostly it's from the foundational perspective like what are the foundations of digital Service delivery so a lot of times you won't come and you won't see a specific demo like an itvm or CSM right we're we're really about that core that supports all of those different offerings on the platform so our big mission here is to help members Drive their own digital transformation right through the education they get through our Forum to be able to take that back to their organizations and use it to support their digital transformation there's a lot of shared work today two of those examples I'm going to give you on how I'm going to share this work that I have and it could be where we're giving you apps like I'm going to do today it could be papers UC Davis shared a paper last year on how to do a service design document right how they're using that and bringing it in and out of the product so I'm part of the Enterprise architecture team in the Americas but our whole architecture team so there's probably about 60 of us across the world support this and you'll be hearing from one of our Architects I think she's on today Michelle she'll be on on one of our future calls we're trying to get her set up so that we bring in more information from around the world instead of just local information like all right so these are you're on a bi-weekly call and that's basically the main way we we um communicate with our members is through this bi-weekly call we're having today but on occasion I think last year the year before we had a half day workshop where we had like 90 people come on we all built out csdm structures and then we came back to the group periodically throughout the half day and we shared what happened in our little breakout group so those are pretty fun too we sometimes we do those breakouts sometimes we meet at knowledge when we get on site again so we've had a couple of um different content blocks and knowledge that we delivered as a group okay so without further Ado let's jump into our content today so this one probably a lot of people that are building their digital service portfolios are probably scratching their head a little bit how do I build a 700 node portfolio in 30 seconds that takes a really long time to do so I'm going to share a little turn off your mic I don't know if that was a question okay so what I'm going to do is I'm going to go through these use cases uh and I'm going to show you a little bit I'm going to demo it to show you how you can use it but I'm also going to describe a little bit of how it's built because some of you'll see some of the components on here that are useful and I want you to be able to go in and take that part of app that app apart and do different things like one of the one of the actions in here you'll see that's pretty useful is parsing a spreadsheet right so how does how does the servicenow service consume a spreadsheet and then build a structure from that spreadsheet there we go thanks for muting all right the after that I want to talk a little bit uh I did this I worked with a one of our cities I'm going to talk a little bit about Atlanta a lot of times people say when they're using public services right because you have our Employee Services a lot of folk people are focused on employee service a lot of people focus on shared services but when you get to Public Services there's this this requirement to register a lot of times but everybody doesn't want to register every time they need a service so there's different different approaches you can use to let people come in anonymously and still interact with servicenow in terms of submitting something so I'm going to take I'm going to show you I'm actually going to go into their prod system and show you a little bit about the design on that and then I'm going to share that with the group as well so that if somebody does need to have Anonymous access to public services they will be able to do that and then at the end I want to talk a little bit about the structure so when I talked about the the three different areas we have today right we have the Digital Services Forum on servicenow communities YouTube channel we have the shared instance I want to add a fourth one today and I want to talk a little bit about this on the GitHub repository so we'll come back to that after these demos so basically here I'm looking for GitHub uh experts because I'm surely not one of those and if somebody in the community were able to step up for that and actually host our GitHub repository that'd be welcome if not we'll have to do it and and Link together private repositories like I'm going to show you today all right if any questions before I start you can drop them in the chat and then um Charles or Rachel if you can just let me know if there's something I should address in general or if if you guys can't pick that up all right so I'm not sure if everybody's familiar with this but uh this is this is studio so I built a small app it has a catalog item in it and this is a build new service taxonomy catalog item it has a workflow in it and what this will do is let me import a taxonomy so this this build new service taxonomy is actually going to realize how small this was there we go so this this workflow that that we use are it's going to actually build that service portfolio for me so that's how I get there in 30 seconds right I basically submit a spreadsheet with my structure in there uh just my business service structure right now and then the workflow is going to build a taxonomy for me so that I get a digital portfolio out of it and then what I had to build on the back this workflow calls this action which says let me parse an Excel spreadsheet okay the other part of this I'll come back to a little bit after I build this and I want to share it with all you because you might want to take a spreadsheet you might have your services in a spreadsheet and you might say well instead of off you know entering you know I deal with States Most states have between 700 and 1200 Services instead of entering these one by one or building really complex Transformations maybe I could just come in and use this application all right so build new service taxonomy is our catalog so let's go ahead and take a look at what this thing is and so if I if I go to the service directly I just put this in in my catalog the default service portal um so all I need to know is a demo for digital service forum and then I'm going to upload my template file right so so basically what this is is this is an Excel spreadsheet that I can upload and I have that in my downloads directory right now so I just uploaded some things and to adhere to the structure I talked about a few weeks ago and um and this follows it pretty closely right there's this market-facing section where it has a bunch of services in there there's internal employee services and then there's shared services so these are services that people can use as building blocks in order to provide those in order to for other people to build either employee services or public services okay and then there's another account here where we're putting our our build tools inside of another folder and so I'm going to import this spreadsheet and I'm going to feed that into this taxonomy here so I'm going to upload that one I just showed you the other part on here is um form example okay so now we're building a new service portfolio called demo for Digital Services forum and we're going to import all of those Services into there and you'll notice on the spreadsheet there is a and if you guys have logins right the idea here is you can come in and use this same thing to build out your portfolio but the idea here there's a taxonomy node under this portfolio called demo for DSF and then underneath that taxonomy node there's a service and underneath that service there's going to be one there's going to be multiple service offerings right so hunting fish in this case has a bunch of different service offerings right so when we go ahead and we we submit this request oh I gotta upload my template file let me try that again I was talking about it too much instead of form example services so the validation works on the form all right so now it's waiting for approval and I got 120 in there so what I'll do is I'll go back into uh my requests and just approve that one and you have to do this approval manually I'm gonna I'll fix that so that we don't have to do it manually but just to show you the process that the workflow is going through uh this here this this is um 120 that just came in so I'll just go ahead and approve this one right now we're off and running with our workflow and then what will happen here is that we should have uh once that workflow runs we should be able to see that we imported our Excel spreadsheet and then we we ran that built new taxonomy should be approved now and then we give it a few minutes there and we should see that we have our portfolio in here it was in there the demo for DSF always in there I just missed it there it is all right so so we're not going to have any metrics yet because we haven't run performance Analytics but the idea here is that we went in and we parsed the Excel spreadsheet we brought in all the different things in there and then um underneath the Public Services hunting fish and then you can see all the offerings underneath there that were in our spreadsheet so as we there's ways to uh I went through this in other demos I'm not going to have time today but in other ones where we actually start building the metrics out on this but from here once you import it I didn't bring in I think I didn't bring in owners yet right I didn't bring in all those people that could be brought in in the spreadsheet so you could modify my workflow to actually take other columns out of that spreadsheet if I put the owner the portfolio owner or the service owner you could actually do that with your build so I'm gonna like I said we're gonna take a little peek at the workflows for that uh but you'll also start getting on fishing and regulations for example I can now go into the details and if you start mapping demands against phishing regulations I'll now see all the demands that are coming in I'll see all the projects that are started I'm going to zoom out a little bit if I go into the build phase the build phase is now if if I just went in and Associated one project or one Epic with phishing regulations it's now going to show up here so so you're providing that view out to the solution owner through digital portfolio management View okay so that's just an example A lot of times people are looking at this saying well do I only manage like if I go back to the internet Enterprise portfolio am I only looking at servicenow services and the answer is definitely not uh like especially with public services when we go in somebody else is probably going to be doing hunting and fishing right so what we're doing is with this one we're just wrapping the support wrapper around it we're able to launch all of our Improvement initiatives around this right so if we're on public hunting and we want to say hey I want to put it or public hunting maps rather I want to put a new demand against this or I want to do an improvement initiative right this is the idea for that solution owner usually like this shouldn't be an I.T person this should be somebody that's out that is actually doing all the hunting Services they should be able to launch an improvement initiative or a new demand for a new feature on public hunting maps and the same thing we committed the hunt and fish level there's that same level of I want to do something across all the hunting and fishing services okay so that's that's what this it gives you the ability to start talking about it you can do it in our our sandbox instance right this is the one if you email me I'll give you admin access to it to come in and see what I did um but that's part of it any questions on that before we go is there anything in the uh in the chat Charles or Rachel okay all right I want to give you a little bit of a peek at how this works so if I go back to where he's done yes there is one in the chat my mouse wasn't working there um it's from Jeff Aldrich and it's a little bit tangential um so I'll just read it out here and then uh I think it's maybe more of a people comment on it in chat it says tangentials to this discussion but something that we're embarking on when defining a service taxonomy both business services and Technical Services what industry resources are people using as a starting point we are struggling a bit to Define Ours from scratch we'd love to have examples that we could use or modify as needed for our Enterprise yeah good question the the only go-to that we see all the time is apqc apqc has some process structures and they they map pretty nicely to Business Service structures and then if you're depending on the industry we have some taxonomies as well so I know for higher education for government I just saw a really nice one on North Carolina site I use their their capability structure to give my initial service structure but those are the only ones I really know of there's it's going to be very industry dependent though once you especially once you get into those Market facing Services versus where the internal Services is pretty steady for the internal Services I have one more thing we had a presenter on here about a year and a half ago and servicenow did a bunch of research on service taxonomies and that is available in our share um where you can go see what they did this p-card experiment to say how does an organization classify their services so that's another resource too you'll find that on our on a digital Services Forum community now I'll try to send something out to with some other resources on the Forum that's a good question any other ones okay that's it that I see okay all right so let me show you a quick thing so this studio when I I build the catalog item you saw because I submitted the request the workflow that picked up that catalog item once I approved it I want to show you just a quick view of that because we touched quite a few tables as we go through so this is the workflow I defined in the beginning what it's going to do it's going to take that name that you built out so after it gets all the variables it's going to scrape the variables off of that list so it's getting the service portfolio name and then it's also able to get the attachment that I created to it now once it has that it's going to go ahead and set up some flow variables so it's going to take that name and put it in the portfolio name so I'm using basically a variable and then it's going to look up and it's going to say is does that portfolio already there they already have a portfolio called you know DSF example and if it doesn't find it it's going to build it if it does find that it's going to add an underscore at the end right because it's a duplicate and then it's going to try again so so it builds the portfolio and then after that it's going to build a taxonomy layer in that portfolio so that's gonna it's just gonna call it Service Group and that's the layer where all those you know all the taxonomies go into after it creates a taxonomy layer it's going to go ahead and get that attachment that Excel spreadsheet and then when it runs the attachment it's going to go ahead and um I'm going to call a an action here so so when it gets the attachment it's going to parse Excel file so this is this is a spoke that I created that will parse our specific Excel file so you guys can use this for other things too it's a really good template if you just want to feed in Excel into a catalog item but what this will do is it's going to go ahead and take it takes one input only it's going to take that Excel file as an input and then what the script step is going to do it's going to parse out that the node on there so so every node is basically a line in XL and then at the end it's going to put an output out and it's going to give the output is basically going to be an array of those line items that have the taxonomy node the service and the service offering and it's going to feed that that structure right when I do the parse it's going to feed that structure back to our workflow so now this guy ripped apart the the Excel file and the steps that I'm doing here and after it went through that Excel file and parsed it now we can go ahead and do operations on it so I can create the taxonomy layer um and then for each of the items in the Excel file I can go ahead and um see if the taxonomy node is there if taxonomy nodes there I'm going to use it if it's not there I'm going to create it and then if if I do find it and there's one existing um I'm definitely want to use that one so I don't duplicate that taxonomy node and then we have that we have that um for context we have the taxonomy node that we're operating in so now I can come down on the bottom build my business service and add it to that taxonomy node and then the same way as I go down you'll see where I build the service offering and then add that to the service right so it's kind of that stack of things that we're adding out of the spreadsheet so that's all the detail I wanted to give you on the workflow there's there's just two pieces to it so it's a pretty simple app there's a lot of there's some complexity in in the action in the workflow but you know you guys won't have to deal with that you'll just have to deal with these high level objects when you're using it if you want to modify the workflow to add like a service owner on you can do that pretty easily okay so this app um how do we get to sharing it that's the piece the last piece I want to get to with you so this app you can't come and just take it off of the ins well you could if you know how to do that you could take it off the instance but I want to make it a little easier for you I want you to be able to go ahead and get it in GitHub right so what I can do here is I can say go ahead and apply these changes to my GitHub and all right the um it's going to show you the repository configuration but I basically have source code control set up so what I can do now is I made some changes here today so I'd be able to commit these changes and that basically pushes all the stuff that I did in this workflow it's going to push it up to GitHub so this way anybody can get that version off of GitHub right so I can include these changes and and basically put some comments in there and then this commits those files up to GitHub so now what I did is I took all that configuration I did for this app and then I pushed it out inside of an area in GitHub so that you guys can come and get it right so in GitHub here you'll see that I have this create digital portfolio from Excel and I have some new because I just submitted to it right so what I have to do is I'd have to say okay take this new stuff that John just built and and add it to the the main branch and and this way that Main Branch if you come in if I once I do this merge once you come in and you say hey I want to get that off of GitHub now you can pull that app down into your instance so a the value in using it in our instance in our shared instance and then B if you need to do this yourself you can come up here and pull it down uh so quick question here on how do I pull that down uh so if you go into Studio all right this is your application and when you go to Studio it's going to say okay what application do you want to work on and what you're going to do is you're going to say import that from Source control now what you'll be able to do is take that URL from from my instance right so I can go up here and I could take this is my GitHub I can copy that and then what I'll be able to do in studio is I'll say that's that's what I want to import I want to pull that app into my instance you'll need a credential so there's some pretty simple examples for getting a credential there and then you'll be able to import that I already have it so I'm not going to import it so be able to import that work on it yourself and then if you want to you can make changes on your side and even push it back to our GitHub repo so that I could take if somebody else wanted to add an Excel file with a with a user on it we can have different branches on that so the idea here for the Forum would be to be able to do a bunch of these and be able to share them with everybody so that we we get rid a lot of the headaches right that's what we're here for so that's that's one of the headaches that we can get rid of is how do I import a spreadsheet across all those tables right so this this will help you do that at least build out that part of the common service data model right that cell consumed part of the common service data model so hopefully I see a bunch of people creating their own portfolios here now because it's so easy uh and then you'll be able to go ahead and operate on those any other questions I want to pause again and make sure I'm not yeah we've got a one on how does it deal with duplicates yeah good question I I covered that briefly but I'll just go back through it again basically what it does is if you look at our portfolio you'll see I had some duplicates in there what it's going to do is add an underscore at the end until it's original so through all my testing when I kept screwing up I was getting like 30 underscores under here because I was duplicating uh but what it's doing is it's looking in the cmdbci services table to make sure this way it gets you know it's not a duplicate of any service so even if we're putting this in the in the business service table right we want to go all the way back to the root of that the base table which is cmdbci service because we would still get a conflict even if we're putting it in the business table so those underscores you see here because there's other ones in here called hunt and fish already and it's the same thing on the portfolio like if there was another demo for DSF yours would get an underscore if you ran that same job again there's another one um John I think folks will want to Fork it first and get it from their own GitHub ID yep you can when you come up and that's where I say I'm not a GitHub expert but uh yeah there is a way to go ahead and Fork this and I'll show you where I have so I built this uh there's this other one the public service template and I know a couple of people subscribe to that one and in here what I'll actually be able to do is is this walks you through all the GitHub pieces so this talks about creating an account um it talks about going in and um there's like a readme in there it also talks about forking the repo before you go so you're not loading it right from that one so when you go in here I have some configurations to do um make it public so there's some instructions in here on how to do some of those things is that a Charleston yeah I think everything else seems to be a comment as opposed to a question so okay if I missed you please speak up all right so let's let's switch off that one and go to that sorry John this is Jeff can I just ask a quick question when when the version changes how do you update it in your own studio so let's say that you found that somebody fixed a couple bugs or it went up a whole major release how do you re-sync do you just re-pull it down through the source control yeah yeah they'd push it up and then you'd pull it back down you'd have to pull down that Branch again okay let's jump back to all right so that's a little bit about the components of that app like I said it's only three components right but those the um the action uh got a little detailed uh with parsing the Excel but that was a cut and paste as somebody else did most of that for me on the community and I was just able to grab that code in and then parse that down and then um and then we did a demo of course the next piece I want to talk a little bit is about Anonymous access and some of you I know struggled with this because there's um there's some things you can't do like if you give somebody a public form it's pretty easy in service now if that public form is just like a PDF right I just want to come in here and there's there's no reference list to drop down there's no attachments on it I don't really have to interact with the system as I'm filling the form out but usually you want to have a drop down list right I want to have a reference list not be able to pull these things out so having Anonymous you're basically logging somebody in to the system as a shared user but you want the behaviors of that logged in user to not be the same as a regular logged in user so I'm going to show you these are really popular for 3-1-1 with cities I did one in Santa Monica is using it and then also the most recent one in Atlanta is a little bit different because we give you the option to either log in as a user as a citizen of Atlanta or go ahead and continue as that Anonymous user but like I said we want to have some if we do that we want to have some different behaviors in the browser uh so so if I go into um Atlanta 3-1-1 so this is their prod system they just went live with this Anonymous last week and one of the problems that they had here with volume was they would do something they would search for a service right and then in order to say go ahead and request pothole what it would say is um actually I don't gotta here now can we go back and do that one more time and this is a little bit about the the front end of the service right is the how do you the authentication piece uh so pothole and then I am not not logged in so I go request pothole and now what it says is um I can go ahead and register and a lot of people are like you know what I'm not going to bother with this pothole or this street light or this graffiti report I'm not going to bother with it if you're going to make me register just too much of a pain so what I can do here is I can opt not to register right now or log in but continuous guest is another option and once I continue as guest what it's going to do behind the scenes is log you in as as this public guest user because we're logged in as public guest user we're able to still use all of the reference features in our drop downs we're still able to do attachments because we do have an authenticated user on the system but some things you'll see up here is we don't have a menu that says look at my request right because I don't want to go back and show you every single public guest request that got filed uh there's also some Behavior changes in search so if I go into search I certain search sources are not available to that user so they're they're really restricted on the search sources that they can see and then the access to different information they have and so as a public guest you have to change the Behavior now a couple of the um the discussions that happen around public guests is they're like wow that's really not good so some security people are probably on here like no way so there's a lot of talk about when we do go in and request this um do we put capture in front of it right do we put a little resistance there so people can't just start dumping things into the system so those discussions have come up too and if there ever is a kind of this this place where people are creating a lot of tickets we'll be able to do that also capture at the form itself right that's another option that you can do with CSM at this point we wanted to make as little friction as possible for the citizens uh so we just you know let people come in and and and choose Anonymous as the option a couple of other things in here like on Santa Monica One of the things that we're able to do is um we do it a little bit different in Santa Monica because we we do log people in as public guests immediately like we don't give them the option to register and then the other thing we do for in Santa Monica is we have we we learn their location so a couple things that you know about me even though I'm a public guest is if I put in my first name last name and email address I can actually create a record so that I I hold your email address this way if you send me other other emails later right I'm basically know that you submitted a case under that email already so we do a little bit different for public access in Santa Monica than we do Atlanta but it's the same idea um the map is in here we haven't done that in Atlanta yet but this is a an esri plug-in that we used here that I demoed before and that's another shared piece that's in that GitHub bucket is that esri piece so so in that in that template um in that GitHub repository there's a whole bunch of things that I built for the community inside this public service template and one of those things in there is that esri map so if you went down here the anonymous user that I showed you here there's some code in there for that there's some code in there for um public portal creating public forums uh there's some things in here for the map so it'll tell you how to create that esri map and then there's a standalone for that as well all right I'll pause again for any questions on on Anonymous access thank you anybody struggling with that right now all right there's a question here uh could you create a mobile version of the cat item that auto derives your location using your phone's GPS you can um and we've done that so if you go download the uh the Santa Monica mobile app we've done that and um it's actually in the form it's going to render it but it's using instead of using esri it's using the native phone map interface so it's a lot easier to do that on a native mobile app if you're using if you're just using the browser on your phone it's going to use the same thing and it scales and everything but if you're using native mobile through our native mobile app API then you would probably use the the native maps on mobile so so if you do go into the the store you'll see this app we built for for Santa Monica and that's that'll give you an example of how the map goes there so they're kind of walking you through a mobile experience it's a little different than this one so they they do it screen by screen they ask you to pick your location first and then after you pick your location then it asks you what the problem is so there's this kind of you know more of a process driven mobile experience than than this web experience I'm showing you here so there's kind of two answers to that right depending on Native mobile or mobile web on mobile web it does still use the location service on your phone because that's a browser function it's not a mobile function okay and then there's a follow-up it means that installing the mobile app you have to give consent to use the mobile phone GPS right yes yeah and the other thing is you have to build it like servicenow doesn't have a mobile app for Citizens so the one for Santa Monica we've built on react mobile so it was a re so it's a react app and it's using basically three interfaces you're dumping in Santa Monica so it's it's our knowledge it's our case management all of the records that go back to it are from servicenow and then there's an outside CMS that we're using so sometimes people want to use servicenow as the CMS for that mobile app and other times they might want to use something that they've been using all along so we did they did have an existing CMS so we didn't use that from servicenow pretty cool app and if you get a chance go check it out Santa Monica um I think just look up Santa Monica in the Play Store you'll find it when you put the URL in the chat please for um for the mobile app no for that site offer this one for that one though yes sir all right thank you you're welcome hey that's the one where you're not going to see The Continuous continue as uh public because it's not giving you a choice and then the Atlanta one is the one where you have the choice to log in or create an account or continue as a continuous public continuous guest yeah I noticed with Google Chrome it popped up know your location allow our block yeah yep so if you let the browser know your name that web page basically you're granting that web page permission for that service okay last piece here so I I want to talk a little bit more about is there any GitHub experts in the in the group because one of the things I'd like to do is like I said have this is a fourth asset area for the Forum so that instead of it's like I can go and put a link to this app on our Forum but then it kind of gets buried right as we go down that blog post where people won't be able to find out how to build this this portfolio how to get to that app would it be nice is to have a GitHub repository that's not John spurco but it's Digital Services Forum GitHub repo and then allow other people in the group to submit to that repo so if there's anybody that would be able to help me with that or actually take that on and demo it on the call one day I think that would be a huge asset for us to have um especially as we get into like next year Rachel talked about wanting to get more into some some industry specific content like maybe doing a a little segment on energy and utilities or a little segment on Health Care especially as we get it'd be nice to have the repo and actually as we mature be able to say okay here's some Health Care specific apps that you can import so if anybody does have expertise there or know somebody that does that would be able to lend a hand let me know I'm not willing to take that on myself because I don't know enough about GitHub like I know about forking a repo and doing that merge but I know there's a ton of stuff to know about it and how to manage like a group like that I would not be in my wheelhouse of uh of knowledge all right any other questions in there that I clear all those out and if you're more comfortable if you guys have any questions want to come off mute feel free to do that as well all right so you know where to get this you know where to get this if you want to put it on your instance or if you want to use it centrally you can try those out on the um on the sandbox instance all right let's look at the agenda a little bit last week on the call there was a lot of people that commented um to you know about some of the content for the next few meetings we're only staying two out in front we're trying to get to like the content at least planning four meetings out in front so that people have an idea of agenda and like this today was pretty technical right but if other times are going to be talking about like financial management on these services so there's going to be different we know the audience is going to swing depending on what the content is we're also splitting it up now so different ones of us rods on today Charles on today Rachel's on today I think Jason was out today but um we're gonna we're basically running these meetings so that we have access to different people like a lot of times I bring my customers in that I work directly um so over the next few weeks you'll see where we're staging meetings where different people are owning the content so if we look here these are our attendees and we have a mixture of servicenow and and other people on here this is what I'm three contributions is um actually I presented two contributions I changed that because of time I have one other one that I could show you but that's basically today um the the one we talked about last week which I I'm really looking forward to this one is we're going to bring a few people that are cscm implementers and we're going to get them I don't know if it's gonna be a panel or where a couple people that have done this in the field uh we're look and I I specifically looked with uh Jason we looked for people that really got their hands dirty with this so they had some some really messy Business Service tables and service offerings so they had to unwind all that stuff right it wasn't just like this pristine environment like I demoed today where you could just start dumping stuff into the tables it's like first I got to get some some type of Baseline established with what we've done over the last eight years in the instance so that'll be a really good one and then after that uh we're gonna have more of an EA Forum we have a couple new EAS on our team and uh Michelle's on the call today I I I think we got her I don't know if she's available yet we did get confirmation from Amanda hey Michelle I don't know if that time's good for you so I I tried to get an email but it was late your time when I sent it out so which week where are you October 27th 27. yeah that's good for me and the thing with um like some of us on the team haven't been EAS before and both Michelle and Amanda have been Enterprise architects so I asked for some perspectives on csdm and Amanda's fairly new to csdm but Michelle has been around it for a long time and the other thing Michelle I think will be good for you is like the csdm is our example to the industry standards being determined outside of servicenow right so so talking a little bit about I know you have a huge background on that and even authored some of the stuff that feeds the csdm Futures so that I think that's going to be an awesome meeting too uh yes I'll be mapping the cstm into into archimatum and looking how we can start using Enterprise architecture tools alongside the now platform as well so that's always an interesting thing to do yeah yeah it's a lot deeper than the little demo I did here dumping stuff into tables a lot of the planning behind that and then Charles uh Charles is putting some content together so we'll have that block filled in next week but yeah if you do you can contact any of us it does you don't have to look for Hey I want to do something that week but we we're definitely looking for customers to come in and talk at any one of these if you if you want to come into an existing one that we have on here let me know and if you want your own your own section we we definitely want you to to come in so we'll be reaching out to some people like I do on occasion I say hey Lou come in and speak or um you know a couple times we had people speak about financials we brought people in for that so we do have specialists in the area but we're definitely looking for more people that are practitioners out in the field actually doing this to come up does anybody have an idea for a concept or content that they'd like to kick around today on the call we have a little bit of time yeah because the last one we had to present back here was Cassandra so if anybody has any kind even if you want to bring stuff that's you know that you're having trouble with we don't need a polished demo to come out of this a lot of times my demos break on these calls right I'm like oh yeah here's where I'm stuck and so that's what the The Forum is more about than than you know doing this really pretty polished presentation we want to see everything we want to see where people are running into problems well and I was going to throw this out here and I will just you see my name at the bottom of the thing I'm Charles Bartley and uh my topics still to be determined that I've got some ideas I'm working over if you've got an interesting problem that you're working on and you want to do a like tag team on it like here's how we are thinking about approaching this problem I'd love to collaborate with you and and try and work through some things might turn into a really interesting discussion cool yeah we did one a few weeks ago where we brought in one of our actually there was one customer that spoke after and Cassandra was um esri is a partner and a customer of service now so they talked a little bit here and um I mean we have a little bit of time I want to show you one more thing before we adjourn today is uh there is a all these meetings just like this one we did today are going to be on our YouTube playlist so I also post the video in our Forum so you'll be able to get to it from anywhere but all these past meetings that you see on there they're available through this uh playlist so I'll put this playlist in there and that's so the one where this meeting today that we're on uh will be on here within the next two days I'll just paste that out there because I know a lot of you have it but for those of you that are new that'll be a good link to bookmark any other questions ideas John this is Alan prohaska yeah thanks um this may be farther down the um get back on the maturity curve but we're struggling with uh service definition you know once the strategy was was announced okay we're gonna you know move towards Services then immediately Ever every organization develops their own list of services and the granularity is all over the map and generally what we see is that everybody looks at the important things that they do and they and they put that on a line and then they write service after it and and so um everybody you know makes their own Services they don't agree um you know of meshing them is difficult and we um are in a bit of a I guess you could call it a quagmire and I'd be interested if I I see this as probably mostly an or change management issue rather than one that's strictly technical definitional but um breaking the service paranoia Log Jam is that you know everybody has to have their stuff called a service in order to be important in order so that they'll retain their job that's the mindset that we face and and we need to loosen that knot were they are they actually dumping stuff into the uh Services table is it open to people to do that it's off platform you know we haven't yet gotten it um onto the platform and so there there's spreadsheets around um you know in various repositories various SharePoint sites okay yeah a lot of that does get back to governance and um we had a couple conversations on that um do you have do you have a Consolidated Pipeline on things coming in in terms of building out those Services no we've got lots of pipelines just about everyone that you can imagine yeah because I think that's the first part of the governance is trying to get it into a single choke point so you can get your arms around it and then get some some type of architect's eyes on it before it lands in the repo yeah that's kind of the short answer that we that we've talked about today so we've talked about that a little bit um you know kind of this function as we come through and I did a little demo on that in a section we talked about governance where we actually fire off tasks every time a demand comes in we fire off tasks so there's visibility to the um to the EA team uh but there's a lot of other pieces to that the other part we talked about that'll be useful for that is one of one of Jason sessions where he talked about some governance of the Big G word were you on that one it sounds familiar it what we're really stuck on is what is a service and we can't get agreement on that got it yeah so the service definitions and the principles yeah the the mechanics like many things once you have agreement on the on the models the mechanics you know of building them you know become you know less difficult but if if there is an agreement on on what is a service that's where we're stuck right now and so everybody everybody defines their own version and they don't agree yeah one of the um semantics yeah Romantics yeah one of the the um the big pieces in here that Jason talked about is having a couple of these roles filled not dedicated people right but um there's definitely something around the data management okay right the master data management part of that is is a big chunk of it and then also being able to do ongoing validation of a service just like you would in app right so we should use the data validation function on the platform to make sure we're asking people you know is all the stuff filled in there so they come back to the record periodically to update anything so once you have that owner assigned you can assign them tasks to manage their own data but I think that structure in the beginning we can't have people going crazy without naming conventions or anything like that or else you'd end up with a big mess especially when you try to put it in a portfolio okay yeah so these um these roles there's actually these uh presentations that Jason shared during this video here are in this link in the um so if you don't have those already I'll take a look at those again but it talks to you about how you're structure and how you get that person involved in ongoing planning um and then the one I did a little separate is how you get those that architecture function in the pipeline piece the other part that we're talking about a little bit too and looks like one person may have multiple roles and we do see some some combinations executive sponsors are usually I thought Jason was talking on the meeting I didn't realize I clicked the button any other questions or else I'll give you guys some five minutes back two raised hands Brent uh yeah this is Brent canip for um I'd like to see or see if it was discussed I'm new to the meeting today but watched a few of the YouTube forums and thanks for uh being able to join I'm interested in seeing uh service you know the uh a little bit more about the csdm product views uh and I'm looking at sort of the Venn diagram for APM csdm and SPM I uh I I think the approach of the product is a good start on docs.servicenow.com but a bit more of a deep dive you know into uh into that Journey um so I've seen you know have experience implementing uh service portfolio management and application portfolio management but this digital portfolio Mansion I appreciated the YouTube I think the great approach is it's it's a you know a data workbench and it just gets richer and richer with the data I think that's a good mindset but I think a you know a double-click discussion uh of that cross-section of uh you know with a focus on you know who are the primary stakeholders that have to have the budget and consume this to make it effective in an organization yeah and have you um have you done the fundamentals because they give you some really good documents in there too csdm fundamentals yeah yeah but back you know back you know to when the 2.0 3.0 desperately wondering why 4.0 is not being formalized it's been sitting for a year in draft yeah the thing is it's in Tokyo docks so if you go in Tokyo docks all the pictures are 4.0 so yeah but I mean you know the white paper I don't know we're supposed to just say you know that the white PDF is just a draft and you use docs I mean there's been no sort of communication Around The Next Step In the Journey of documentation yeah that draft two of the docs um of the PDF that was shared on the community is consistent with what's in the Tokyo documentation but it's still called draft to your point so that's not cool not really yeah I just you know you think drafts it's for a month or something three months maybe for a company's biggest service now and at some point you got to say it's the real thing yeah and the other piece is what exactly has been implemented in the products the various pieces of the of the platform you know yes the the definition might be out there it might go from draft to production but what's actually in use already in or when's it coming yeah that's a big part of I think why we didn't why it took so long to get it out was there's a lot of life cycle stuff that's in the model that's not being used by the products yet so that's I think that was a lot of the hesitancy there right that new quadrant that's the life cycle quadrants the product teams aren't leveraging those pieces yet so it's yeah that's why that's why I wanted to move sort of to the pragmatic which is I assume these product views are fairly mature and I I think they are I've implemented SPM service portfolio management 8 PM multiple times so I think it's there and that's why I think it's probably a good timing for this kind of audience we could have a pretty good discussion around uh service portfolio management application portfolio management and digital portfolio management talking about you know the pragmatic Journeys in my experiences it's not an infinite number of patterns that people see you know two or three and everyone's gonna go down one of those things absolutely yeah so the uh the other part of that too is uh getting out in front of it we have we do have forward-looking things on here and I know some of you have just started today but if you go back to that YouTube channel uh we got a little bit of insight into like version five and six of csdm from Mark when he uh he came in during this one the it operating models of tomorrow so he talked about digital products and what's coming in five and six and he talked a little bit too about the product teams being behind and adopting those life cycle stages so this is Mark talking a little bit about that back a couple months ago but it's still pretty relevant we haven't released cstm5 though so he's talking a little bit about all the new pieces in here hey John I I didn't think I didn't think there was going to be a five are we skipping five hey John Bill Berry here real quick before we jump off hey Bill hey how you doing hey um on that topic that came up about what is a service um I would love to see us have um you know 20 minutes or even a half an hour on the agenda for a Roundtable discussion with those that are interested because it gets even more complicated when you try to reconcile the difference between a service and a capability because you mentioned apqc but we use apqc as capabilities yeah those are very structured you know level four and Beyond as you know processes and they all make complete sense but Services kind of came into play after the notion of um of capabilities hierarchies and it's kind of creates a problem so I'd love to see that as a topic of discussion and I know that I'd be uh active panelist on that if we wanted to do like 20 or 30 minute Round Table yeah and the other thing that would be a good topic there bill would be product portfolios versus service portfolios because absolutely uh products I guess the intersection of product service capabilities because it really yeah it uh and looking at it from a business perspective versus a technical perspective and I.E am I looking upward or downward yeah and so I imagine Michelle will talk about that a little bit uh that's kind of in her wheelhouse but we'll also uh we'll put it on the agenda there and in the Forum we're talking a little bit about new content so I think that's a really good one very cool on there that core service definition I wonder too in trials and tribulations if that's going to be a big point of discussion too is what are the real services like how do we even start with that uh this is bran I I think if you look at some of the idol 4 it for I.T that stuff's been out there a long time there are service definition templates you know have give you plenty more than enough content the problem is you know I think it has to get back to the uh funding right if someone isn't willing to pay for a service and sign up for it then it can't be a service and this is where you allow disconnect people want a lot of things but if no one is willing to understand what the cost of that is and pay for it then it can't be a service yeah oops sorry guys I got to drop I didn't realize we're over good discussions I'll I'll definitely get that on the agenda for us so we can have a round table maybe it's in the trials of tribulations maybe we just do that in the next meeting Jason all right thank you everybody good discussion today appreciate it